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Post by Hatboy on Mar 10, 2015 17:56:30 GMT
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Post by Boomer on Mar 10, 2015 19:11:22 GMT
To be honest, Hatboy, I don't think the majority of posters are overly worried where they finish in the Prediction League.
I do suspect, however, that most supporters are not too happy when posters start slagging off players. It happened back in December and it now appears to be happening again. I wonder if these posters would have the bal.s to say what they are saying on here to the players' faces. I think we all know the answer to that. As James Gray says in the press, confidence at is at an all time low with the players at present, in fact shot to pieces in many instances. It certainly doesn't need to succumb to any further damage on here. It is cheap and not helpful, one little bit.
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Post by Canary Saint on Mar 10, 2015 19:36:13 GMT
To be honest, Hatboy, I don't think the majority of posters are overly worried where they finish in the Prediction League. I do suspect, however, that most supporters are not too happy when posters start slagging off players. It happened back in December and it now appears to be happening again. I wonder if these posters would have the bal.s to say what they are saying on here to the players' faces. I think we all know the answer to that. As James Gray says in the press, confidence at is at an all time low with the players at present, in fact shot to pieces in many instances. It certainly doesn't need to succumb to any further damage on here. It is cheap and not helpful, one little bit. What has changed to bring about this crisis of confidence? (I wonder)
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Post by PaperSaint on Mar 10, 2015 19:41:31 GMT
Well said Boomer. Unfortunately I cant make tonight's game (as need to be the dad taxi. ..) but will certainly be putting my support behind the team on Saturday afternoon. I have massive respect for the non-league footballer - who has to not only do a full shift at week during the week but then also has to keep in shape and try to deliver on the pitch week in, week out as well. We are also 3rd from bottom in the wages table so we are having to compete on that basis as well in terms of who we can attract to our squad.
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Post by jj123 on Mar 10, 2015 21:20:29 GMT
I have been home and away this season, and have witnessed some of the worst performances for a long time (Concord, Wealdstone, Bath) - I thought the point of a message board was to be able to voice your opinion on all matters about the club positive and negative - why are all criticisms met with a "would you ever say that to the players face" - I probably would if given the chance.
I'm sorry if you find my posts negative / don't agree with them but we are on an appalling run of form and are slowly slipping into a relegation dogfight, we have two owners who aren't really bothered about the club and are only trying to make money out of it - which was never going to happen. Our 'star' signings have not been up to scratch (Pires / Clarke)
Yes last season was great and the play offs were fantastic - but it's time to move on and move forward - and sadly 60-70% of our first choice 11 are not up to it at this level.
We have the best CM in this league who would comfortably play in the league above and we continue to hoof it past him - it's just not good enough I'm afraid and the loyal fans are starting to vote with there feet - lack of flags at recent games etc.
I don't think we will go down but we desperately need to sort it out, get rid of the deadwood in the summer and crack on.
What's the latest with this fans committee ?
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Post by PaperSaint on Mar 10, 2015 21:56:44 GMT
Absolutely agree that all opinions should be capable of being voiced. And I will add my opinion that when team confidence is at a low, then it is for the fans to get behind them rather than against them. I will be heading to Clarence Park on Saturday and - given the recent bad run of results - will be giving my support to my team.
I also question your comment that "we have two owners who aren't really bothered about the club and are only trying to make money out of it". I am a relative newcomer - but have made a point of talking at least to Lawrence Levy and also Nick Archer - as well as attending the Fans Forum. I don't know John McGowan and haven't spoken to him. However, Lawrence comes across as someone who does care about this club - as does Nick of course - and I have not seen any evidence of him only trying to make money out of it. They would all have to be terrible business men if that's all they wanted - given the serious difficulties in even having this club not make a financial loss. The only evidence I have seen so far is that they are propping up a club that currently can't generate sufficient income - without owner subsidies - to compete at this level.
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Post by jj123 on Mar 10, 2015 22:33:32 GMT
Well, how about raised ticket prices for one, McGowan not attending a single home / away game this season and probably last - Levy just sold his business for £11m? So he's not short of a few quid?
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Post by PaperSaint on Mar 10, 2015 22:46:32 GMT
So he sold his business for £11m - I am not sure that then means he is obliged to hand it over to the football club. I didnt and don't agree with the ticket price as I feel it was a false economy decision. Again I can't comment on McGowan but Levy comes across as someone who wants to see the club become a success rather than end up yet again in another crisis.
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fatboy
Saints Youth Team Player
Posts: 200
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Post by fatboy on Mar 10, 2015 23:19:04 GMT
McGowan not attending a single home I have no views one or the other , but to be fair he has been at quite a few games with his kid but he sits out the way and watches the games in peace with his child.Seen him at away games often too.
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Post by bob666 on Mar 11, 2015 2:33:22 GMT
"We are also 3rd from bottom in the wages table". I do not dispute this is correct but what is your source for this? I be interested to know relative club budgets.
Given our budget it is unavoidable that we will have to field players who not going to be entirely comfortable at this level and there is no point in criticising players for not being better than they are. On the hand, I think legitimate to ask questions about our disciplinary record - you cannot just will yourself to be a better player but you can avoid pointless bookings for dissent etc. Also if you suspect that a player levels of commitment have fallen (not that this is a issue with the overwhelming majority of the league) I think it is legitimate to say so.
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Post by COYS on Mar 11, 2015 3:25:33 GMT
Frendo's been a victim of his own success this season. 15 goals in 32 games for a side in the bottom half of the table isn't a bad return at all for a player who hasn't played at this level before. Did anyone really expect him to be getting the (almost) goal-a-game ratio he was achieving in the league(s) below? Anyone who did is on a different planet. He's had to play a different, more unselfish role this year and, in the games I've seen him play, has actually done it pretty well. I think it's the easy option to blame him; if I'm honest a bigger issue is the fact we're leaking goals and haven't found an effective, consistent style to compete week-in, week-out at this level. At times he's cut a frustrated figure, I'll admit - and if that's what people are criticising him for on the back of recent performances then fine, fair enough. On the playing side of things I believe the only reason there's this pessimism about the team is because of the price hike, and that wasn't the players' fault. I'm not suggesting we give up on protesting the fact but it has frustrated me how miserable we all are at having almost stayed up (won't count my chickens just yet but we're in a decent position). Yes, we're not playing the best football and yes our form at the moment is pretty unacceptable, but I believe we'll see better days on the playing side of things next season, with the experience both the managers and squad have got. I won't comment on the endeavour shown in the last few matches as I haven't been able to make it, but I feel like with a little perspective we can't complain too much about this season as a whole.
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Post by bob666 on Mar 11, 2015 4:45:25 GMT
Frendo's been a victim of his own success this season. 15 goals in 32 games for a side in the bottom half of the table isn't a bad return at all for a player who hasn't played at this level before. Did anyone really expect him to be getting the (almost) goal-a-game ratio he was achieving in the league(s) below? Anyone who did is on a different planet. He's had to play a different, more unselfish role this year and, in the games I've seen him play, has actually done it pretty well. I think it's the easy option to blame him; But how many of them are from open play? Of course no one expecting a goal a game but this is my key issue he essential missed pre-season and (I admit this is a subjective judgment) I do not think he been 100% fit at any point this season. If the numbers often quoted regarding his wages are correct than its not unreasonable to expect him, having missed pre-season, to be doing the physical work (in addition to group training) he needs to be as fast (I know he lacks natural pace) and fit as he can be. When Ram came last season you could not tell he missed pre-season because of his personal commitment to his fitness, leading the life of a sportsman. Maybe I am wrong but cannot help think that the Spanish trip is indicative of Frendo's lack of commitment necessary to be effective at this level. As out top earner he going a natural focal point of criticism. The reason I would be more critical of Frendo than some players who may preformed worse than him is that I suspect (obviously I don't actually know) that problem is as much one of application as ability. You cannot criticise someone for lacking ability, you can criticise someone for not trying (and I not talking about the 90 mins but leading the life of a sportsman more generally)
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Post by COYS on Mar 11, 2015 5:15:30 GMT
But how many of them are from open play? Of course no one expecting a goal a game but this is my key issue he essential missed pre-season and (I admit this is a subjective judgment) I do not think he been 100% fit at any point this season. If the numbers often quoted regarding his wages are correct than its not unreasonable to expect him, having missed pre-season, to be doing the physical work (in addition to group training) he needs to be as fast (I know he lacks natural pace) and fit as he can be. When Ram came last season you could not tell he missed pre-season because of his personal commitment to his fitness, leading the life of a sportsman. Maybe I am wrong but cannot help think that the Spanish trip is indicative of Frendo's lack of commitment necessary to be effective at this level. As out top earner he going a natural focal point of criticism. The reason I would be more critical of Frendo than some players who may preformed worse than him is that I suspect (obviously I don't actually know) that problem is as much one of application as ability. You cannot criticise someone for lacking ability, you can criticise someone for not trying (and I not talking about the 90 mins but leading the life of a sportsman more generally) I don't necessarily disagree with your criticisms, bob666. In all honesty, I think a lot of them are justified. I just think the wages you reference & his reputation make him the easy scapegoat. Perhaps I'm alone in thinking this but it does surprise me to see his name brought up so often when criticising the playing side of things. A bigger concern for me is, like I said, just an outright failure to gather any consistency nor reliable system over the year, and Frendo can only take a small portion of that blame.
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Post by St Michael on Mar 11, 2015 6:56:39 GMT
Our position at the moment is not John Frendo's fault, nor any individual player. Frendo is technically a very good footballer, and on this ability alone could be playing at an even higher level, but, his natural lack of pace is the reason why he isn't. Gray and Golds are good people, and they know that the "team" is not working, and this is now a real test for them. Confidence is gone, and the 5/6 players who are good enough to flourish at this level now doubt the rest. The team is not together. 11 players of even moderate ability can compete at a level beyond their natural ability if they play together. This is something that Gray and Golds urgently need to confront and change. First of all they need something we have lacked all along, a really effective leader on the pitch, and the defence needs to be rock solid, because we are not looking like scoring many goals.
Maybe this season has been about learning and adapting as Gray has often said, but we cannot afford to be relegated, because our benefactors, Levy, McGowan, might well lose interest and we could then spend the next 5-10 years messing about in the leagues below.
I will always support City, and I always have, but I resent being called a troll ( not recently) and accused of being negative. We must be prepared to be critical of our club. Why is it permissible to attack the owners but not be crtitical of the players and coaches, all of whom are paid by the club ? Why must we be afraid of upsetting the players, but happy enough to denigrate the owners whose own cash has revived the club !
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Mar 11, 2015 11:04:18 GMT
third bottom of the wages table, were are we in the ticket price table ? better to moan or be negative or whatever on here than on the terraces
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yellowalf
Saints Reserve Team Player
Posts: 301
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Post by yellowalf on Mar 11, 2015 15:10:06 GMT
I'm sorry if you find my posts negative / don't agree with them but we are on an appalling run of form and are slowly slipping into a relegation dogfight... I don't think we will go down but we desperately need to sort it out, get rid of the deadwood in the summer and crack on. Interestingly, Staines lost last night which means they have 8 games left and are 22 points behind us. So if we win one more game or Staines lose one more game then we cannot occupy bottom place. Farnborough, on the other hand, are 10 points behind us with two games in hand. And we are 2nd from bottom of the form guide with just 2 points from the last six games. We still have to play three of the five teams below us which is of no use if we can't beat them, or at the very least draw. Still, the good news is that Saturday's opponents, Weston-super-Mare have won five of their last six games. Gulp! We have the best CM in this league who would comfortably play in the league above and we continue to hoof it past him - it's just not good enough I'm afraid. Absolutely agree - he should be the fulcrum of our team, not impersonating a plane spotter.
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Post by Hatboy on Mar 11, 2015 18:06:15 GMT
To be honest, Hatboy, I don't think the majority of posters are overly worried where they finish in the Prediction League. I do suspect, however, that most supporters are not too happy when posters start slagging off players. It happened back in December and it now appears to be happening again. I wonder if these posters would have the bal.s to say what they are saying on here to the players' faces. I think we all know the answer to that. As James Gray says in the press, confidence at is at an all time low with the players at present, in fact shot to pieces in many instances. It certainly doesn't need to succumb to any further damage on here. It is cheap and not helpful, one little bit. What exactly has that got to do with me posting about the prediction table having not been updated lately ?!?
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Post by Boomer on Mar 11, 2015 19:45:44 GMT
To be honest, Hatboy, I don't think the majority of posters are overly worried where they finish in the Prediction League. I do suspect, however, that most supporters are not too happy when posters start slagging off players. It happened back in December and it now appears to be happening again. I wonder if these posters would have the bal.s to say what they are saying on here to the players' faces. I think we all know the answer to that. As James Gray says in the press, confidence at is at an all time low with the players at present, in fact shot to pieces in many instances. It certainly doesn't need to succumb to any further damage on here. It is cheap and not helpful, one little bit. What exactly has that got to do with me posting about the prediction table having not been updated lately ?!? That table is about 6 weeks old though It was actually a response to a previous poster, making a comparison between two separate subject items and, what I felt, was their comparative importance, which just happened to encapsulate a reply by yourself to the same poster. That's all.
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boojiboy
Saints Reserve Team Player
Posts: 329
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Post by boojiboy on Mar 11, 2015 22:38:29 GMT
We have the best CM in this league who would comfortably play in the league above ? Really?!!
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yellowalf
Saints Reserve Team Player
Posts: 301
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Post by yellowalf on Mar 22, 2015 13:04:53 GMT
I'm sorry if you find my posts negative / don't agree with them but we are on an appalling run of form and are slowly slipping into a relegation dogfight... I don't think we will go down but we desperately need to sort it out, get rid of the deadwood in the summer and crack on. Farnborough, on the other hand, are 10 points behind us with two games in hand. And we are 2nd from bottom of the form guide with just 2 points from the last six games. We still have to play three of the five teams below us which is of no use if we can't beat them, or at the very least draw. Dragging this thread back up to date for one reason only. I'm not sure if anyone still thinks Saints have got a chance of being relegated, in case they do let me report that Farnborough lost 7-2 at home to Bath City yesterday. That means that if they win their remaining 6 games they will reach 46 points. So, if we beat bottom-placed Staines on Saturday to get to 44 points, we will need one more win to guarantee safety IF Farnborough win at Bishop's Stortford next weekend. Obviously, iif Farnborough lose or draw then we will be safe. Farnborough are averaging 0.67 points per game over the last six games, and 0.82 points per game over the season. So, do you feel lucky, punks?* * Yes, I know that's a misquote, but everyone else does it!
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barker
Saints Youth Team Player
Posts: 135
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Post by barker on Mar 22, 2015 14:04:52 GMT
... and Staines won away at Bromley... we'd better be careful about playing the 'bottom' club ...
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Post by citycentresaint on Mar 22, 2015 16:21:39 GMT
We will stay up and should be pleased with how we have got on in the Conference South.
Hopefully things off the pitch can progress going forward.
COYS
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Post by westwalessaint on Mar 22, 2015 16:40:34 GMT
Yes - let's have some positivity - especially as I'll b coming to watch the Sants next week. I think I predicted 14th for the season so I thi that's still a possibility. That's okay for the first season back.
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yellowalf
Saints Reserve Team Player
Posts: 301
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Post by yellowalf on Mar 22, 2015 18:23:24 GMT
We will stay up and should be pleased with how we have got on in the Conference South. I agree. Although we may look back at missed opportunities, the priority on our first season back at this level was not to be relegated. Mission accomplished!
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Post by Hatboy on Mar 24, 2015 20:32:40 GMT
... and Staines won away at Bromley... we'd better be careful about playing the 'bottom' club ... The NLP says that Purse expertly marshalled their defence, if we play him like we did in the play off final there shouldn't be a problem
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