National League North Next Season?

[jj123]

Very tight at the bottom of the National League, with: Oxford, Woking, Dorking in the bottom four

and

Dagenham, Maidenhead, Southend, Ebbsfleet, Wealdstone just 1-4 points above.

Could National League North be a realistic option next season?

[porkypig]

Not if we want to end up like bishops stortford,it would be financial disaster.

[jj123]

I dont think they chose to go into the National League North…

[euclid]

Would guess Braintree would be first choice to go North, Hemel next then us !!
Oxford City would go North if they come straight back down, which is looking likely.

[sideshowbob]

That's why I said it. Players would leave because of the ridiculous distances.

[lagerman]

In an ideal world, and l think I've said this before, it'd perhaps be useful to have a National League Midland Division to help with regional issues, but without a major rehash of things, l'm not sure it's doable, and in anycase l guess you'll still get placing issues. Nice thought though.

[boojiboy]

Feb 27, 2024 11:35:52 GMT euclid said:

Would guess Braintree would be first choice to go North, Hemel next then us !!
Oxford City would go North if they come straight back down, which is looking likely.

Clarence Park is further north then Hemel’s ground.

[sideshowbob]

Having a Midland division makes sound sense, travelling wise and running costs.present system is crazy, bishops stortford going to curzon Ashton on a Tuesday night, or even worse blyth Spartans.

[lagerman]

Feb 28, 2024 15:08:36 GMT sideshowbob said:

Having a Midland division makes sound sense, travelling wise and running costs.present system is crazy, bishops stortford going to curzon Ashton on a Tuesday night, or even worse blyth Spartans.

It does, but to inaugurate a Midland Division, a few more teams would have to be "promoted" up to make up the numbers, and you'll basically have to have a complete reshuffle right the way down from there to balance up the divisions. I can't see it happening, even thou it could be the answer

[middxsaint]

Feb 28, 2024 7:58:55 GMT boojiboy said:

Feb 27, 2024 11:35:52 GMT euclid said:

Would guess Braintree would be first choice to go North, Hemel next then us !!
Oxford City would go North if they come straight back down, which is looking likely.

Clarence Park is further north then Hemel’s ground.

Hemel are further up the M1.

[sideshowbob]

It doesn't matter who is further north it's the wrong division for any of the clubs, total lunacy.

[middxsaint]

One solution would be to have 26 clubs in the south and 22 in the north. That would give us 50 league games.

[jj123]

Feb 28, 2024 22:56:27 GMT middxsaint said:

One solution would be to have 26 clubs in the south and 22 in the north. That would give us 50 league games.

And how would that allow for equal promotion and relegation?

[manfrommars]

Considering Boreham Wood have been in the national league for a fair while now, would putting them in the North be a more sensible option, considering they might be able to handle travel costs better unless matchday revenue doesn't do anything which maybe possible considering they don't get big crowds.

[saint68]

Mar 30, 2024 9:28:38 GMT manfrommars said:

Considering Boreham Wood have been in the national league for a fair while now, would putting them in the North be a more sensible option, considering they might be able to handle travel costs better unless matchday revenue doesn't do anything which maybe possible considering they don't get big crowds.

I'm afraid that's probably wishful thinking. Both Hemel and ourselves are north of Boring Wood and have easy access to the M1. On a good day we can be in Yorkshire in 2 hours, which is probably how the National League will view it.

We have to hope that Kidderminster are relegated, that should see us safe from a sideways move. However, if they stay up it'll be four southern teams coming down and I reckon either us or Hemel will join Oxford in the North Division. To be honest, I think it could be a disaster, undoing all the progress we've made over the last few seasons if some of our better players decide they'd rather not spend every other Saturday on the M1.

[sideshowbob]

Being put in the north division would be economic disaster, most of the budget would go on travelling costs, and we would do a bishops stortford. It would put the club back five years.

[jj123]

Our owners are very very wealthy.

[sideshowbob]

But the supporters aren't,and we would have totally new team. And players have a living to make outside of travelling hundreds of miles to play games!

[middxsaint]

It's a bit unlikely Kidderminster will not finish in the bottom four. They are 4 points behind 20th placed Wealdstone but have played 3 more games and only have 4 more to play, one of which is away to champions Chesterfield. Oxford City are already relegated and will go north.
Not sure what the positions with Rochdale and Southend United are now, which could change things.

[bob666]

Obviously it would be a blow if we got moved North but Bishop Stortford average attendance is under 500, ours is 1649. With all the wet sales at CP surely the travel costs would not be crippling unless we plan to hire helicopters for each match. I take the point it might not suit some players and like I say it would be a bad thing but surely it would not represent some form of existential crisis? I not entirely convinced by the idea of a midlands league for what its worth. This would effectively means you need another 24 clubs currently playing below tier 6 to step up to this level- if you kept the leagues the same size. Inevitably this mean would mean that the average quality of the sides would be worse. You have to promote the 8 or so from each of the 3 feeder leagues- assuming you still want Dover etc and teams who clearly cannot compete relegated. The gap in quality between tier 5 and 6 is already massive- you don't need to further dilute quality at tier 6. One thing do wonder is if 24 teams is really a good idea for any part-time league? Midweek, particularly away, games must be hard for some players. I like slightly smaller leagues and for midweek fixtures to just be used for rescheduled games or as a result of long cup runs

[EFMTFTV]

The only way we will def end up in the North is;

3 Southern teams (+ Oxford already in the North) relegated from the Nat League
Hemel Relegated
Braintree Promoted

I'm pretty sure I've heard in the past that Hemels centre circle (which is how they work it out) is slightly more North that ours, but don't quote me on that

If we did go North we'd get some kind of financial compensation from the league I'm led to believe

[boojiboy]

We are definitely further north then Hemel.

[Boomer]

Apr 1, 2024 17:59:52 GMT boojiboy said:

We are definitely further north then Hemel.

Not according to the National League - it's all worked out according to road access etc - e.g. Vauxhall Road is right on top of the M.1. and is deemed further north, apparently.

[sideshowbob]

Yawn! Yawn!

[jj123]

Apr 1, 2024 18:29:35 GMT sideshowbob said:

Yawn! Yawn!

You ok?

[norfamptonsaint]

If (when) we get promoted to the National League, it will mean travelling around the country anyway.

[boojiboy]

Apr 1, 2024 18:08:19 GMT Boomer said:

Apr 1, 2024 17:59:52 GMT boojiboy said:

We are definitely further north then Hemel.

Not according to the National League - it's all worked out according to road access etc - e.g. Vauxhall Road is right on top of the M.1. and is deemed further north, apparently.

Where have you seen that out of interest. As far as I knew, it’s never been made clear what that criteria is and no-one ever knows the splits until they are made.

[lagerman]

I've always believed that geographically, it's decided on the lateral position of a Clubs position.
For there to be no decisions to have to be made at the end of this season and for next season, we're really relying on York City and Kidderminster Harriers finishing in the bottom four, as there are more than enough southern based teams down there.
Kidderminster, despite beating the Champions Chesterfield yesterday, still remain in the bottom 4 and look like they are going to drop, but for York to be relegated .... well, its touch and go, they might just have enough in the tank to beat the drop. There are no other northern based teams in sight really, so it's looking like a geographically uneven 4 coming down. Worst case scenario is that Kiddy and York escape the drop and all 4 relegated Clubs are southern based !
God knows what will happen then

[Boomer]

Apr 2, 2024 11:43:50 GMT lagerman said:

I've always believed that geographically, it's decided on the lateral position of a Clubs position.

If it were that simple. From what I understand, amongst other criteria, it also involves ease of road/motorway access etc. Oxford City are further south than ourselves, yet they will likely drop into the National League North next season.

[boojiboy]

Without wishing to be a smartarse, I did check this last year because we had the same concerns then and I am even more concerned this year. The latitude of the centre circle of each pitch is quite easy to find on Google Maps. Oxford is the furthest north, followed by Clarence Park, followed by Hemel.

I have also heard that the criteria is not set in stone and that they will take into account access to motorways etc. but I’m not sure to what extent that has been tested. Oxford City have previously played in the NLN but that is because they are the most northerly of our batch of clubs.

Either way, I’m cheering for Wealdstone and hoping the Kidderminster drop plenty of points over the next few weeks…..