ebsacfc
Saints Reserve Team Player
Posts: 256
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Post by ebsacfc on Nov 29, 2015 17:07:12 GMT
Who do people want? Any ideas who's available?
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Post by casper on Nov 29, 2015 17:40:20 GMT
Who ever the next manager is, it's going to be a big decision by the chairman and owners. In some ways they got lucky with Gray and Golds, as it could have been very different with 2 inexperienced managers. I hope they take some advice from someone with football experience, as I don't see much football knowledge on the board. 20 points from the first 10 games quote from the chairman makes me shudder now.
Make the wrong decision and we are back in the Southern / Ryman, get it right and we stay in the league. How we stay up is not as important as avoiding relegation.
We need a manager with experience, even if it is only until the end of the season. Inexperience will relegate us.
The only name that springs to mind is Ian Allinson who has returned to The Wood as director of football.
I just hope we don't end up with the manager of the Dog & Duck Sunday League team .....
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Post by St Michael on Nov 29, 2015 17:42:04 GMT
Jon Brady, ex-Brackley Johnson Hippolyte, ex-Maidenhead Jason Goodliffe, coach B.Wood, but has been a manager Mark Bentley, Grays Ath. Liam Daish, unattached I think, probably expensive. Richie Hanlon/ Paul Hughes, Kings Langley Adam Parker, asst. Hitchin, lacks experience ?
My choice would be Dean Brennan, but why would he leave Hemel ? And, this might be our problem in general, biggish club, good support, not much money.
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Post by casper on Nov 29, 2015 17:47:26 GMT
Martin Hayes - ex Bishops Stortford currently at Waltham Abbey.
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Post by casper on Nov 29, 2015 17:49:05 GMT
Jon Brady, ex-Brackley Johnson Hippolyte, ex-Maidenhead Jason Goodliffe, coach B.Wood, but has been a manager Mark Bentley, Grays Ath. Liam Daish, unattached I think, probably expensive. Richie Hanlon/ Paul Hughes, Kings Langley Adam Parker, asst. Hitchin, lacks experience ? My choice would be Dean Brennan, but why would he leave Hemel ? And, this might be our problem in general, biggish club, good support, not much money. Richie Hanlon ?? You must be joking
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Post by St Michael on Nov 29, 2015 17:54:06 GMT
Yep. Actually Hayes might be good idea. Adam Flanagan at Concord might be good too but unlikely to leave.
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Post by PaperSaint on Nov 29, 2015 18:07:31 GMT
Micky Hazard and Franco Sidoli at Hadley - Hazard might be interested in moving up to this level
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fatboy
Saints Youth Team Player
Posts: 200
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Post by fatboy on Nov 29, 2015 18:09:49 GMT
Micky hazard was on my list as well
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Post by sideshowbob on Nov 29, 2015 18:14:15 GMT
martin hayes seems reasonable, johnson hippolyte, adam parker and hanlon is that a joke?
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Post by St Michael on Nov 29, 2015 18:25:18 GMT
Probably.
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Post by Boomer on Nov 29, 2015 19:32:31 GMT
We need a manager with experience, even if it is only until the end of the season. Inexperience will relegate us. You are so right. The club needs someone, who is experienced and has achieved some level of success at least at this level and, preferably, above and has good contacts generally within football. Just as important, it needs someone who is able to show authority and someone, who can work within a mid range budget. It is imperative that the club makes the right decision here. Making the wrong one is not an option, even if it takes time to make the decision. We cannot afford to return to the Southern League, that is a definite. There is always the possibility of appointing a temporary manager pro tem, until the position is filled on a permanent basis. Ex- Saint Paul Fairclough could fit the bill and is also local. I like the idea of Martin Hayes in the long term. I also would not rule out Gary Roberts. I guarantee there will be no shortage of applicants. COYS!
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Post by casper on Nov 29, 2015 19:42:04 GMT
We have Margate on Saturday then a free weekend after exiting the FA Trophy, so we have a little thinking time. Harry in charge for the Margate game wouldn't be the end of the world. We may get a reaction out of the players anyway, going by some player tweets.
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Post by ex-saintswebbo on Nov 29, 2015 20:42:52 GMT
Micky Hazard and Franco Sidoli at Hadley - Hazard might be interested in moving up to this level Franco Sidoli? Where the heck did you get that from? Oh my giidy aunt.
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Post by bob666 on Nov 29, 2015 20:53:12 GMT
Is their not a bit of contradiction between the ideas that the club ought to take its time selecting the right manager for the long-term and that we must stay up? We 5 points of safety and two of the next three games are matches we need to win (Margate at home and Basingstoke away) if we to have a realistic chance of staying up, we could be down by Christmas (regardless of who takes over) unless we rapidly improve.
This might just be my ignorance but why would relegation be such a disaster? Do we get a large payment from the conference south for being part of the league? If not then I think the evidence is that as a top 10 Southern League side attendances would be no lower than as a bottom 10 conference side- attendances must also be linked to commercial revenue etc . I don’t think there was a significant change in attendances between 2013-14 and 2014-15, despite more midweek matches in 2013-14 and the fact away support would be lower in Southern league. So are there massive financial implications? Personally, I think I would prefer in the Southern League attacking and winning most weeks than struggling in the conference. I know a lot of people will disagree but if you take into account midweek effect and away support I venture a guess that we actually get more home supporters as a top 10 Southern League side – which would suggest that I no alone in my opinion. Unless there major off field changes we always be a lower half side in the conference that loses more than it wins- I think I perfer the Southern league
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Post by sideshowbob on Nov 29, 2015 21:03:59 GMT
with that sort of outlook why bother winning promotion, just stay in the southern league, a rather defeatist attitude.
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Post by bob666 on Nov 29, 2015 21:13:39 GMT
If we the lowest budget in the league as ApplySaint suggests (what actually has boost the budget achieved?) than we probably don't really belong in the league. On person defeatism is anothers realism. Some clubs have turned down promotion maybe we should untill we have the financial structures in place to compete at this level
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Post by casper on Nov 29, 2015 21:34:32 GMT
Sunderland were bottom of the Premier League, shipping goals left right and centre with players who couldn't defend. Sam Allardyce has gone in and the same players are keeping clean sheets and they are winning games now.
Maybe a different voice and a change in instructions / tactics can get more out of our current squad than the previous managers ?
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Post by St Michael on Nov 29, 2015 21:43:14 GMT
I always think that Braintree are a good example of what can be achieved with a relatively modest budget, and limited support. Good coaches and astute management of the club has brought them several years ongoing success in the Conference National. Perhaps they are hugely in debt, but so are most professional or semi-professional football clubs. We probably have more potential support than Braintree.
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Post by sideshowbob on Nov 29, 2015 21:57:16 GMT
totally agree about braintree, they don't get great support and have stayed up without much problem, are they a bigger club that us? potently i don't think so.we should be able to emulate them.
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Post by PaperSaint on Nov 29, 2015 22:03:47 GMT
Yes Braintree are a good example of making a small amount of money go a long way. Hopefully we can emulate their success
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Post by sideshowbob on Nov 29, 2015 22:05:46 GMT
ment to say potentially
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Post by sideshowbob on Nov 29, 2015 22:06:08 GMT
and meant, christ i'm drunk!
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Post by bob666 on Nov 29, 2015 22:15:30 GMT
In a sense support is not the key thing, budget is. We clearly have a better support than the wood but at present their highest sustainable level is much higher than ours. If Braintree are managing 9 in the conference with the lowest budget in the league than congratulations, there management team must be expectional. My point is that it is not reasonable to ask any manager to produce a top 12 team consistently on the lowest budget in the divison - maybe 1 manager in 1000 can do this. I remember that some statisticians studied the relationship between budget and success for premier league/ championship. There the odd anomaly but the correlation quite tight. I suspect the same in true of non-league. Basing you stragegy on finding a 'genuis' manager is like basing your retirement plans on the lottery. Unless we can sunstantially increase the playing budget the only realistic choice is the lower reaches of the conference south (I suspect last season might have been a high watermark) or potentially winning most weeks in Southern league. Personally, (and it is a subjective judgement) I would rather the later
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Post by Boomer on Nov 29, 2015 22:37:25 GMT
Is their not a bit of contradiction between the ideas that the club ought to take its time selecting the right manager for the long-term and that we must stay up? We 5 points of safety and two of the next three games are matches we need to win (Margate at home and Basingstoke away) if we to have a realistic chance of staying up, we could be down by Christmas (regardless of who takes over) unless we rapidly improve. This might just be my ignorance but why would relegation be such a disaster? Do we get a large payment from the conference south for being part of the league? If not then I think the evidence is that as a top 10 Southern League side attendances would be no lower than as a bottom 10 conference side- attendances must also be linked to commercial revenue etc . I don’t think there was a significant change in attendances between 2013-14 and 2014-15, despite more midweek matches in 2013-14 and the fact away support would be lower in Southern league. So are there massive financial implications? Personally, I think I would prefer in the Southern League attacking and winning most weeks than struggling in the conference. I know a lot of people will disagree but if you take into account midweek effect and away support I venture a guess that we actually get more home supporters as a top 10 Southern League side – which would suggest that I no alone in my opinion. Unless there major off field changes we always be a lower half side in the conference that loses more than it wins- I think I perfer the Southern league Sometimes I despair of you, Bob. With your reasoning, perhaps we should join the Herts Senior County League and win, week in week out. There has to be ambition to improve and move in an upwards direction, otherwise, why bother at all. Also this would not have come about, if we had been plying our trade in the Southern or the Ryman League. www.cityyouthfc.co.uk/index.php/community/998-saints-and-city-youth-partnership-obtain-40k-grantThe other thing, of course, is that income from sponsorship is likely to be severely impacted, should we be relegated, especially after the fantastic work done by our Commercial Manager, who has done so brilliantly over the past two seasons.
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Post by Boomer on Nov 29, 2015 22:54:09 GMT
If we the lowest budget in the league as ApplySaint suggests (what actually has boost the budget achieved?) than we probably don't really belong in the league. On person defeatism is anothers realism. Some clubs have turned down promotion maybe we should untill we have the financial structures in place to compete at this level If this, if that. You have no idea of our exact budget figure so why even bring it into the equation. There are a fair number of teams in the lower half of of our league, who I suspect are all probably on a very similar budget to ourselves - Hayes and Yeading, Bishop's Stortford, Wealdstone, Concord, Hemel Hempstead etc. I would also be amazed if WSM and Truro City's budgets were anywhere near ours. Coupled with this, as St. Michael alluded to earlier, it is not necessarily the size of the budget you are given but more the effectiveness of how wisely you work with it and use it. St. Michael quotes Braintree Town - a great example of a club, who have made excellent managerial appointments and who have worked with/are working with very limited resources.
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Post by casper on Nov 29, 2015 23:02:27 GMT
If budget is everything, look at Margate. Budget probably in top 3 in the league, experienced manager who has taken teams into football league and kept them there and some players who have played at a higher level. Where are they ? Only 5 points above us and we play them on Saturday. A large budget isn't everything ( but it does help )
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Post by PaperSaint on Nov 30, 2015 3:51:36 GMT
On budget (my final words on the topic now...!), yes we have one of the lowest but there are several clubs on similar budgets. Our budget means it would be very difficult to promoted from this league but shouldn't mean we have to drop out of the league ie we should be able to compete and (like last season) battle well mid-table.
And teams like Margate are misfiring even with significant funding as Ebbsfleet did last season. But we have actually - with a little extra Boost - put together a decent squad of players (albeit some still yet to convince me of their quality) who I believe are capable of becoming a team that can compete in this league. Key is going to be who can now come in and make that work ie the point of this thread where we have made suggestions of who we think might apply/be considered for the job.
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yellowalf
Saints Reserve Team Player
Posts: 301
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Post by yellowalf on Nov 30, 2015 7:34:14 GMT
If not then I think the evidence is that as a top 10 Southern League side attendances would be no lower than as a bottom 10 conference side- attendances must also be linked to commercial revenue etc . I don’t think there was a significant change in attendances between 2013-14 and 2014-15, despite more midweek matches in 2013-14 and the fact away support would be lower in Southern league. Average attendance 2012/13: 376 (11th place finish) Average attendance 2013/14: 515 (promoted!) Average attendance 2014/15: 570 (13th) Average attendance 2015/16: 521 (20+) Certainly not much difference between this season and the promotion season, but considerable difference between 2012/13 (and a finish just outside the top-10 threshold set by Bob666) and last year when we finished bottom-10
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Post by davymac55 on Nov 30, 2015 11:42:53 GMT
I have a problem with having the managers go at this point as I think that it is two months too late to see a miracle happen. I hope I am very wrong On managers several issues/questions Anyone any good is managing already surely? Why would a GOOD manager whether managing or not come here? Why leave a well placed lower league team to come to a potential relegation team , go down and the previous team get promoted into this league? Anyway,We don't really want someone from a lower league with no experience at this level. Been there. Done that. Richie hanlon? However, There is an ex National League manager who apparently resigned due to work commitments but is still at club. Could he be interested in part time work commitments again? Cant afford a loss at Oxhey surely?
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Post by PaperSaint on Nov 30, 2015 11:58:28 GMT
That ex National League manager who is also local would of course be an ideal candidate...
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